Did you see the segment, Karol? Malkin insinuated -with no evidence whatsoever- that Kerry had purposely injured himself in order to get a Purple Heart. Then she refused to back off the statement, even though Matthews gave her about ten chances to do so.

And I'd hardly call Matthews a "Democratic waterboy"- he voted for Bush in 2000, and his denunciations of Clinton are legendary.

Steve, did you read her post about it? She was there to talk about A BOOK that makes the allegation that Kerry's wounds were self inflicted. What was she supposed to do? Pretend it wasn't in the book that she was there to discuss?

Karol-

The book says nothing about Kerry purposely injuring himself. When Matthews asked her if she's ever heard anyone accuse Kerry of that, Malkin wouldn't say no, and at one point said (wrongly) that the book did say that.

(see my post on this for more).

haven't read the book, but i read druge.

you left wing water boy, you should try that also you might learn somthing

/scarsm

stephen i am intrested in what you have to say, but you did not post a link to the post you bring up.
please post a link and i will ready it.

though i did hear an interview with one of the fellows that helped write the book on a local radio station, and i remember some stuff about kerry getting gernades blown up too close to him.

My apologies-

http://www.stevesilver.net/mt/archives/005046.html

And if you think I'm a "left-wing water boy," which out a couple posts below, where I rip the RNC protesters a new one :)

"And I'd hardly call Matthews a "Democratic waterboy"- he voted for Bush in 2000, and his denunciations of Clinton are legendary. "

THat might have been true five years ago, but not anymore. I was always a big Matthews fan (I have three of his books, in fact), but the man has become a shill for the Democratic party in the past year or two. He doesn't even try to hide his bias. Hardball went from the best interview show on TV to an anti-Republican lovefest.

I guess Matthews is too stupid to read the book first before discussing it with a guest, and also too stupid to understand the difference between "self-inflicted" meaning not inflicted by enemy firebut instead due to an error or mistake on his own part, and "intentionally self-inflicted" meaning Kerry meant to inflict physical harm on himself.

What a Mook Matthews is.

Read the transcript:

MATTHEWS: No. No one has [ever] accused him of shooting himself on purpose.

MALKIN: Yes. Some of them say that.

Malkin's the one making stuff up; all Matthews did was call her on it.

Stephen:

Matthews never read the book. Malkin was merely saying that there are some people who make that accusation, which is true. How can you possibly say that that's "making stuff up". In this short exchange, Matthews is saying that a certain allegation has never been made by anyone ever. Malkin is saying that it has been made (not by her though). On top of this, Matthews hasn't read Unfit for Command, so it's ridiculous that he would think that he speaks with any authority on the substance of the allegations.

I'm baffled by the way you interpret the exchange you quote. Is it just willful partisan blindness or what?

When has anyone made the charge that Kerry purposely wounded himself? Is there any evidence whatsoever that that's what happened? Because if not, it's irresponsible of Malkin to perpetuate such a charge. Why didn't she just say "no" when Matthews asked her if she believes that?

And Matthews has guests trying to blurb their books every single day- how could he possibly read all of them?

I guess Stephen's too stupid to understand the difference as well.

Again:

MATTHEWS: No. No one has [ever] accused him of shooting himself on purpose.

MALKIN: Yes. Some of them say that.

She is not "perpetuating the charge". She is saying that other people have made the charge. The short section you quote does not, by any stretch of the imagination, show her saying that she believes this. If there is some other part of the transcript where he asks her directly if she believes this, then paste that in. But, this section certainly doesn't show her "making stuff up". Anyway, even if he did ask her point blank whether she personally thought his wound was self-inflicted, I don't see how she honestly could have simply answered "no". I mean, you never know with Kerry. Was he in Cambodia in Christmas 1968 or wasn't he? Are his fellow soldiers "war criminals" or part of his "band of brothers"? etc. etc.

As far as reading the book. You must really not be following this, because Unfit for Command is not her book. It's John O'Neill's book. It's going to debut at #3 on the NYT non-fiction bestseller list, and yes, I would expect that any major political journalist would have read it.

The thing about the self-inflicted wound is a side issue anyway, but since you asked: As I understand it, there is some evidence that one of his injuries may have come from shrapnel coming from a grenade that he threw. This is different than saying that he turned a gun on himself on purpose and fired it, but there is I think some faction of the SWIFT boat vets who assert that, which is all that Malkins is saying. Focusing solely on the shooting-himself-un-purpose thing was either a red herring that Matthews through out purposefully or else he's too stupid and ignorant to realize that shrapnel doesn't come from a gun.

Sahmy- thanks for elevating the discussion.

Eric- I never said Malkin believes the charge. What I'm saying is, it's a reckless, libelous, ridiculous charge, and Malkin didn't she say she doesn't believe it(despite being giving the chance to do so ten different times by Matthews.) And she said "other people" have made it- except the two people she named haven't made it.

If the charge is merely that one of Kerry's injuries was the result of shrapnel from a grenade the he himself threw, I hardly see how that constitutes a "ridiculous, libellous charge". From discussions on-line with people who have military experience, I've gotten the idea that that's a common thing in war and not at all shameful. However, if he lied about it to get yet another purple heart, then that's something else entirely.

If Matthews is referring specifically to the idea that he shot himself "on purpose", then that's a much more extreme charge. However, if there are people from SBVFT who do make that charge, then Malkin's statement "Yes. Some of them say that." is true. In fact, if she answered otherwise she would be lying. And again, keep in mind that she's the one who actually read the book, not Matthews.

Now, I haven't read the whole transcript so I don't know the context but my guess is that they were really talking about an accidental self-inflicted wound with shrapnel from a grenade and Matthews started talking about a purposeful self-inflicted wound from a gun because either: A) It was a red herring to make all the swifties seem ridiculous and to make their accusations sound outlandish or B) He's a moron and he hasn't actually read the book.

But anyway, your effort to make it seem like it's Malkin, as opposed to Matthews, who's acting sleazy here is falling short. Again, the short out-of-context bit that you quoted doesn't speak at all to whether or not Malkin herself says that she believes the charge. She says "some of them say that." By that standard if someone asked me if there are some leftists who say that George W Bush is as bad as Hitler and I gave the truthful answer "Some of them say that," I'm saying that I think Bush=Hitler.

Maybe you have other bits to back up your assertions, but this part of the transcript certainly doesn't.

It was clear that Malkin was there to discuss the claims in the book and Matthews just wanted to get her to represent those claims as her own. Matthew showed his true liberal Democrat colors last night. Since corporate involvement in politics is something the left thinks is bad for American politics perhaps it is time to pull the plug on the GE and MSFT owned show?

Here's Malkin talking about the same issues Steven and I are talking about avoe:

Note that I didn't bring the subject of shrapnel. (Got that, Keith Olbermann?) Willie Brown raised the issue.

Here is how I responded verbatim:

"Well yeah. Why don't people ask him more specific questions about the shrapnel in his leg? There are legitimate questions about whether or not it was a self-inflicted wound."

Matthews frantically stuffed words down my mouth when I raised these allegations made in Unfit for Command that Kerry's wounds might have been self-inflicted. In his ill-informed and ideologically warped mind, this transmogrified into me accusing Kerry of "shooting himself on purpose" to get an award.

I repeated that the allegations involved whether the injuries were "self inflicted wounds." I DID NOT SAY HE SHOT HIMSELF ON PURPOSE and Chris Matthews knows it.

Only someone who had not read Unfit for Command would interpret what I was saying the way Matthews did. The book raises questions by vets, many of whom were with Kerry, about whether there was or wasn't enemy fire during the Dec. 1968 incident that led to his first Purple Heart (Patrick Runyon is quoted in a Boston Globe account on p. 35 saying "I can't say for sure that we got return fire or how [Kerry] got nicked. I couldn't say one way or the other. I know he did get nicked, a scrape on the arm.") and whether the injury came from a self-inflicted wound after he caught a tiny piece of shrapnel when he fired a grenade from his M-79 grenade launcher too close (p. 36); whether or not there was "intense rocket and rifle fire" during the Feb. 1969 incident that led to his second Purple Heart (Rocky Hildreth, officer of an accompanying boat on Dam Doi Canal that day, says there was no "intense rocket and rifle fire" on p. 78); and whether the shrapnel wound in his buttocks, which Kerry says he sustained in March 1969 and led to the awarding of his third Purple Heart, was the result of a mine explosion while on a mission or from a wound from his own grenade that he set off too close to a stock of rice he was trying to destroy (p. 87). See also pages 30-31. I was trying to get to these points, but Matthews would not let me finish a sentence.

Sorry Stephen, but steadfastly adhering to Matthews' mischaracterization of what Malkin was saying might lead someone to believe that very thing.

She never said that Kerry may have shot himself, for Pete's sake, but since I've never been personally attacked so hysterically and unrelentlessly on cable television myself, I imagine Michelle could reasonably have gotten lost trying to attempt to put forth the statements made by the Swiftboat Veterans in their book, while constantly being interrupted by the host asking questions he obviously intended to answer himself.

Malkin has built her entire career on attacking other people "hysterically and unrelentlessly," whether in print or on television. About time she got a taste of her own medicine, I say.

And I'm still yet to hear which of the swifties, if any, have ever accused Kerry of purposely wounding himself.

Clearly, MM did not intend to imply a purposeful self infliction of wounds, but, per SAHmy above, was understandably a little discombobulated by the ignorant, rude, embarassment of a "host" Chris Mathews. I was wishing she'd stand up and pop him one. In any case, I have no doubt Mathews little tirade will sell an incredible amount of books for Michelle, esp given he never mentioned her book once and kicked her off the show. I liked the part about having to ask for her copy back of "Unfit for Command". Apparently, Mathews or the brass at MSNBC couldn't be bothered to get or read their own copy.

Also, like most, I hadn't considered the possiblity of Kerry intentionally self-inflicting his 2 bogus purple hearts, but I certainly wouldn't rule it out now that I think about it.

Eric writes:
"If the charge is merely that one of Kerry's injuries was the result of shrapnel from a grenade the he himself threw, I hardly see how that constitutes a "ridiculous, libellous charge". From discussions on-line with people who have military experience, I've gotten the idea that that's a common thing in war and not at all shameful."

I agree.
But the right wing shamefully finds it shameful if it can be used against a Democrat. How shameful can one get?

Yep..the SwiftBoat Liars..err..Vets DID say that Kerry shot himself. And Keith Olbermann DID call me an idiot. I know these things to be true because I'm a top-notch journalist with a contract from Rupert Murdoch to appear on FOX News.

>>> Malkin's the one making stuff up; all Matthews did was call her on it.

Nonsense, I saw the show. Chris was intentionally trying to confuse the matter by pretending not to know the difference between consequence and intent. She was saying that there is an account in the book in which Kerry discharged his weapon and was wounded as a consequence. Matthews was trying to make her say that "Kerry shot himself" intentionally in order to get a Purple Heart.

He then goes on to deride her with other guests for something she never said -- but he did. Show this segment to any gaggle of 9-year olds and they'll tell you in two seconds which one of them was being disingenuous.

But of course, this is what liberals do when they're losing an argument, they pretend to forget basic word definitions and misconstrue action and consequence. I guess it all depends what the meaning of "is" is.

Funny comments by - "Michelle The Journalist" above.
Malkin is the biggest sellout since Uncle Tom. The right wingers use her and she loves being used.

Chris Matthews doesn't let anyone get their point across unless it is a reflection of his own opinions.... that is the bottom line. Michelle Malkin is HOT and very smart and articulate.

Malkin wins, hands down!!

Guys...please...pay attention...Michelle was there to talk about HER new book, not John Kerry! She had no forwarning about the swift boat book, and the quotes she made were FROM THE SWIFTBOAT BOOK! NOT HER BOOK! GET IT? He ambushed her, plain and simple. All she said of her own words on that subject was to ask Matthews if he really wanted to know the truth, which matthews has no clue about. Typical partyline damage control, Matthews kept spitting at Michelle without letting her respond completely..

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