This reminds me of the dog thing. There are many people who wring their hands over stupidly trivial things in the UK that don't matter. There was the whole Christmas greeting thing (most muslims I know love Christmas). Police seem to have people obsessed with these issues, usually IMO to get them out of doing the harder job put in front of them.

No, bryan, it's demonstrative of how your society is committing suicide. In your myopia, you fail to realize the problem isn't with "most muslims [you] know" -- it's the other Muslims to worry about. Few in number in percentage terms, they're still making your government bow to the point of near-groveling.

How can you not see that your country, in its willingness to be overrun by Mohammedanism, is becoming almost as much of a laughingstock as France? How can you not see that it's ludicrous to waste £12 million annually, so that a bunch of fools can tell you how to raise your children?

Also, putting aside the fact that an armed citizenry is the best way to make policemen's jobs easy, your police wouldn't find their jobs so difficult if, um, they actually had balls. Remember this?
http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2008/05/todays-video-br.html

Others would tell you to take your self-righteous, nanny-state-worshipping dhimmitude, and shove it up your arse. As for me, I'm content merely to laugh at your 5000 years of civilization, unmarred by progress.

Perry, I'm gonna try and send a civilised post your way. Here goes; You have a point. I believe our police would rather stop law abiding people in cars they know they own than take on the smaller (but getting larger) amount of drivers without registration or insurance, for example. On the other hand, they shoot an unarmed Brazilian mistaking him for a terrorist, and then nobody is held to account in public.

I live in a city with a great many different colours and creeds (the latest influx is polish catholics). There will always be someone complaining, and this will always be picked up by those that want to run down the groups they dislike. Also there are people who will assume that offence would be felt by people they don't know much about. Karol (sorry to ask this): would it offend you or yours, as jews, to have been told "The three little pigs" story at school. This was an assumption made today by my sister. I'm not so sure.
Anyway, yes, there are those here who should be deported. I don't know how they can hold anti-west beliefs and still live here. But, they are marginalised. Other muslims inform on them and film them, and then expose them. The fact support my belief that Islamism is not as popular as some would have us believe. Algerians threw them out, and, with luck, and due to their poor goverance, so will whatever palestine is now will.
I've worked with the NCB (was the NCH I think), and, the children it benefits (when I was a children's nurse many years ago). They are sooo desperately 'right on', but their main remit is to look after children at risk from abuse. They used to do this quite well, but I can't speak for now, being out of that loop.
I can't and won't even try to convince you that we aren't becoming a caliphate. This would be a foolish thing to attempt, because there is no way to win this argument outright either way. We'll have to agree to disagree on that one, ok?
5000 years? New Grange Tomb (in N. Ireland) is that old, nut even stonehenge doesn't date back that far. Magna Carta was 800 years ago. Women got the vote 90 years ago, then everyone about 60 years ago. Did you perhaps mean 500? What are you dating it from? Every new thing seems like a bad move, even Dr Who.

but, not nut

have you ever seen yes minister? i think you'd love it, all about the efficiency of the british government.

They smell.

Perry, I'm gonna try and send a civilised post your way. Here goes; You have a point. I believe our police would rather stop law abiding people in cars they know they own than take on the smaller (but getting larger) amount of drivers without registration or insurance, for example.

Naturally. Most living things tend to gravitate toward the path of least resistance, and government-paid employees are infallible that way.

On the other hand, they shoot an unarmed Brazilian mistaking him for a terrorist, and then nobody is held to account in public.

Which I found deplorable, by the way. I also found it amazing, considering your police aren't anywhere near as trigger-happy as ours here tend to be.

I live in a city with a great many different colours and creeds (the latest influx is polish catholics). There will always be someone complaining, and this will always be picked up by those that want to run down the groups they dislike. Also there are people who will assume that offence would be felt by people they don't know much about.

There's no assumption here about Muslims being offended. Muslims have made perfectly clear at every turn that they don't want us to publish this, say this, teach this, etc. They've bombed your Underground, and enough of your local officials are frightened enough to think, "Hey, maybe we won't be bombed anymore if we play along with them a little." It doesn't work that way.

Karol (sorry to ask this): would it offend you or yours, as jews, to have been told "The three little pigs" story at school. This was an assumption made today by my sister. I'm not so sure.

Karol is a rational, intelligent human being. Why would she be offended with that?

But again, you don't realize that it isn't about Muslims genuinely being offended. It's about their faux outrage, allowing them to take that much more control over what you say, what you think, and how you live your lives. Oh, by all means be tolerant of them, but they don't believe they should be tolerant of you.

Anyway, yes, there are those here who should be deported. I don't know how they can hold anti-west beliefs and still live here.

They live among you because they know your leaders won't do anything about them. They know that they're a low percentage of the population, but they can eventually make you acquiesce to enough things that they'll effectively control your society.

But, they are marginalised. Other muslims inform on them and film them, and then expose them.

Apparently not enough, don't you think?

The fact support my belief that Islamism is not as popular as some would have us believe. Algerians threw them out, and, with luck, and due to their poor goverance, so will whatever palestine is now will.

Yes, Palestinians wanted to rid themselves so much of extremists that they...voted Hamas into the leadership.

Algerians rid themselves so long ago of Muslim terrorists that there were three bombings this last June.

I've worked with the NCB (was the NCH I think), and, the children it benefits (when I was a children's nurse many years ago). They are sooo desperately 'right on', but their main remit is to look after children at risk from abuse. They used to do this quite well, but I can't speak for now, being out of that loop.

That's besides the point.

I can't and won't even try to convince you that we aren't becoming a caliphate. This would be a foolish thing to attempt, because there is no way to win this argument outright either way. We'll have to agree to disagree on that one, ok?

Tell that to us, when we see every facet of your government and school system slowly kowtowing to Muslim demands. Tell that to my family in London, who are now so suspicious they think Obama is a closet raghead. They woke up after the 7/7 bombings, in which one of my cousins nearly died (was fortunately delayed getting to the station).

5000 years? New Grange Tomb (in N. Ireland) is that old, nut even stonehenge doesn't date back that far. Magna Carta was 800 years ago. Women got the vote 90 years ago, then everyone about 60 years ago. Did you perhaps mean 500? What are you dating it from? Every new thing seems like a bad move, even Dr Who.

The figure of 5000 years is an approximation. Simple civilization: the time people stopped living in caves and started to cultivate farms, raise livestock, build cities, and develop some sort of writing system. It's a joke one of my old schoolteachers used to tell, and the point is that we view you as not having advanced much for a very, very long time. Your dhimmitude isn't helping that perception.

Not much point in trying to reply, because we won't be able to agree. I think that every set of people has bad people among them, be that set religiously defined, colour defined, whatever. I see little point in pointing at the bad people in a set and using that to condemn the whole set. There are 240,000 jews in this country, and one of them has served time in three countries for drug trafficking. It would be absurd to think all jews are trafficking drugs because of this. as to the filming, exposure, what do you want? Not enough you say. It's this type of pessimism that is impossible to try to change.
I also said that I think Hamas will not survive another election, due to bad governance (spelling!)

We have christian evangelists (they frighten me too) trying to sue schools and companies for this and that as well. You use the word 'dhimmi', if it comforts you to name call go ahead. You haven't changed my opinion with your statements so far. I think 'reactionary' is the right word for what you have said.

Not much point in trying to reply, because we won't be able to agree.

You're making assertions, and as I've said before, I will continue to call you out on your bullshit.

I think that every set of people has bad people among them, be that set religiously defined, colour defined, whatever. I see little point in pointing at the bad people in a set and using that to condemn the whole set. There are 240,000 jews in this country, and one of them has served time in three countries for drug trafficking. It would be absurd to think all jews are trafficking drugs because of this.

But you don't see Jews engaged in drug-trafficking as part of their religion, now do you? That's the difference.

as to the filming, exposure, what do you want? Not enough you say. It's this type of pessimism that is impossible to try to change.
I also said that I think Hamas will not survive another election, due to bad governance (spelling!)

People also believed Mugage could be ousted through a peaceful, democratic election. Tyrants will rig elections if they can, to avoid machine-gunning the people they need as slaves and pawns.

We have christian evangelists (they frighten me too) trying to sue schools and companies for this and that as well. You use the word 'dhimmi', if it comforts you to name call go ahead. You haven't changed my opinion with your statements so far. I think 'reactionary' is the right word for what you have said.

We have the same thing here. The Christian nuts want to declare us a "Christian nation" and restore compulsory prayer, but they never go anywhere. I'm not worried about them. It's making children pretend to be on Muslim caravans, reciting the five pillars of Islam, and praying to Allah, that are acceptable in schools. If it were about pretending to be Jesus' disciples and reciting the Lord's Prayer, a teacher would be fired immediately.

Above should have been Mugabe, not Mugage, but I think you understood who I was talking about.